Cali,

I have went through FPU and it is awesome! My wife and I are working on paying off about $50000 worth of debt! We have been working on Dave’s debt snowball and have already paid off almost $20000 worth of debt in a year! Woo Hoo! Thanks for showing people in the geek community Dave and hopefully it will show people that “Debt is dumb and cash is king.”

David
Phoenix, AZ

You need to come to Nashville more often! Seriously, it was great meeting you guys, and I’m thrilled you got to hang out with Dave for a little while. Keep up the excellent work!

he’s a christian seems like a warning.

Yay! I’ve been waiting for this brief..

My wife and I went through FPU last October, and it was a great experience. We’ve paid off a little under $10k in debt so far, and are continuing our “gazelle intensity”, especially since we now have a rugrat on the way.

Dave Ramsey is a Christian, and it kind of is a warning because some people are so easily offended by anything even remotely religious.

That said, his advice is sound, and would benefit a lot of people. I’m not a very good Christian, but I am a Christian, and a devout follower of Dave Ramsey. It’s worth it for people to check him out, even if you’re not a Christian.

Looking forward to watching the brief shortly here!

Wow, Cali and Dave together in the same podcast! Awesome!

Yes, he’s a Christian. His whole pholosophy is based on the Biblical idea that “the borrower is slave to the lender” and he takes a lot of his ideas right out of Proverbs. Lots of good advice in there.

I didn’t mean it as a warning. I meant the opposite, actually. What I was trying to say was that if you’re someone who doesn’t want to be preached at, you can safely listen to Dave’s show.

I dunno about that.. Dave preaches, but it’s financially.. :)

Awesome Cali!

Interestingly enough, I found you about a month ago when one of the Dave Ramsey web guys posted about you in his blog. I haven’t missed a brief since and barely make it when more than 2 days go by without one.

We’re on Dave’s plan and have made huge progress in the past 6 months. Now just knocking out the student loans.

Cali, thanks for a great brief! You should hit Nashville more often. After you left, Dave commented about what a “nice lady” you were and how much he enjoyed your talk. Good stuff. :)

Cali, you probably shouldn’t bother bending over backwards to avoid offending people with very mild statements, for the simple reason that it’s impossible. Some people will be offended no matter what you say.

I think your hosting is always super-gracious. You’ve got it just right.

I have to agree with John M.

Hey Cali, did you interview him before or after the show yesterday? Just curious.

I know I shouldn’t worry about it, but I have a hippy heart, and I want everyone to love each other and get along, even when we disagree. :)

@scott: I interviewed Dave before he did his show.

We know that’s impossible, Cali. Say what you mean and mean what you say, let the chips fall where they may.

I’ll still have you in my Miro player.

I used last year’s Christmas money to purchase Dave Ramsey’s materials. It was one of the best Christmas gifts I got last year! My wife and I have been ‘acting our wage’ since the beginning of the year. It has been awesome for our marriage and our wallet.

I used to think that I could finance my business (freelance/writing) on personal credit cards. That was a huge lie! I couldn’t make it work. Everything fell apart. When I started living on a budget, my creativity increase, my stress decreased, and I started getting the clients I always prayed for.

I learned that you need to be debt-free and budget-driven if you want to make it doing something like writing or podcasting.

Thanks for bringing Dave to the Brief!

“A hippy heart” ? I’m offended!
“everyone get along” ? I’m offended!
“love each other” ? I’m offended!
“even if we disagree” ? I’m offended!
…actually, I’m just kidding.

did she say “treadmeal”?

I third what John M said about people being offended.

I think you handled the christianity thing just right, Cali. I don’t think it came across as a warning, but it was something that was worth mentioning.

I hadn’t read your description when I watched the episode and found it completely bizarre that this man was mentioning spirituality and the church. Your interview was good, but I don’t think I could ever take anything the guy said seriously.

Just out of curiosity Dom, why couldn’t you take anything Dave said seriously?

Two of my favorite podcasters on one show!

I have a confession to make, though. I had to stop watching GeekBrief, because I kept wanting to buy the gadgets you feature on the show (especially your studio equipment). I’m trying to become debt-free, so I had to cut all the media from my diet that makes that goal difficult. Sorry, Cali.

But I was glad to hear about your interview with Dave Ramsey via your Twitter/Pownce feeds. :)

Yeah, our mission isn’t very consistent with Dave’s. :)

People shouldn’t get offended so easily. It seems like some use every opportunity they can to get offended. That being said, I do think “He’s a Christian.” doesn’t sound quite right but I think it’s purely a “flow issue”. I would have put it like this: “Although he is a Christian, it’s not a Christian show and he does it cool…”

Chris: Simply because religion was mentioned >at all

Chris: Simply because religion was mentioned *at all* by someone claiming to want to help people with their finances.

I don’t care what a person’s religious beliefs are, but I don’t appreciate it when someone uses their position to push their own beliefs on others, however subtle. The moment you do that, it becomes preaching.

I should say however, that I’m in the UK and attitudes to religion are *very* different over here. Mr Ramsey simply wouldn’t get air time, which is part of the reason I found the whole thing a bit weird.

I should also say that my middle name is Dave and my surname is Ramsey. And that’s freaks me out even more. :)

Dom, thanks for your comments and for sharing openly your gut reaction to what Dave said. What you said about the UK perspective is interesting. However, I disagree that bringing up the Bible or the church should discredit anyone’s wisdom, knowledge, or expertise in his field. After all, the impact of the Bible can be seen in abundance in modern ethics, the justice system, and even medicine! If taken only as a piece of historical literature, the Bible has a LOT of wisdom in the area of personal finance and personal responsibility–two things Dave Ramsey hammers day after day on the radio.

That said, yes, I am a Christian, so of course the references didn’t bother me a bit. :) But I do appreciate you sharing from your heart and offering that perspective. And, as a first-time commenter in the GBTV comments, I really like the cool attitude of all of you guys. Good stuff.

This conversation is really fascinating.

@Dom: You’re response is exactly related to the point I was trying to make at the start. You can entirely discount the Bible and still benefit from Dave’s point of view.

I’m sitting here thinking about all the hours I’ve listened to his radio show and the times he’s used scripture to illustrate a point. It’s almost always when someone has identified themselves as a Christian first. I respect his approach so much because he’s the kind of Christian in his media world that I want to be in mine. He isn’t trying to convert people to Christianity, he just seems to care about people and he wants to help them have a better life financially. That motivation has a foundation in his beliefs about what it means to be a Christian. The principals he teaches are sensible, regardless of a person’s belief system.

PLUS! He “gets” social media, and that’s why all this fits in with Geek Brief. I want people who watch, who have an interest in Web projects, to have the same passion for community that Dave does.

@Allen - you’re quite right that the influence of the bible is everywhere. But the influence of many, many religions is everywhere too (particularly Islam in the case of science, maths & the arts).

I think broadcast regulations are stricter over here anyway - so it would be very rare to have any TV show host give their own political or religious opinion.

So I think my point of view is partly shaped by cultural differences and partly by stricter broadcasting regulations in the UK. But I’d still take Dave Ramsey’s financial advice more seriously if religion simply wasn’t mentioned at all.

Hey Cali, great show and nice interview!

Hey Cali,

I have to agree with what Michael Tosla said as well. I cut out the briefs and engadget and gizmodo. Heck the list goes on and on. All I can think about is MAN I WANT THAT STUFF! I am totally geeky and I will def have a lot to do when I am debt free. Gotta catch up on all of the cool stuff out there. =)

Personally, I think it’s just unwise to totally discount what someone has to say because of their political or religious affiliation. Could you imagine the US or UK banning someone from the airwaves because he happened to be a Buddhist? There would be a civil liberties uproar.

Or could you imagine me not allowing someone to fix my car, because he happened to be a Dallas Cowboys fan? (Go, Skins!)

Or not taking a developer’s advice on how to optimize code, because he or she is a liberal?

You can learn something from everyone. You may not agree with every aspect of that person, but to totally discount what someone has to say in all things is just not a good way to live.

If you only listen to people you agree with completely, then you’ll never learn anything.

Everyone has something to offer.

…except maybe Cowboys fans.

Thanks for the warning about the christian references. I know that mainstream USA is highly credulous and accepting towards christian dogma being inserted into their daily lives and media.

I agree with Dom that the references he peppers this interview and his other material with are simply bizzare in context. If any media commentator in Australia or the UK (both places I have lived) tried to proselytize for their arbitrary belief in the supernatural under a guise of other mainstream commentary, they really wouldn’t last long.

I’m not down on the guy or on the concept of giving people advice on avoiding debt or clearing their debts but if “The principals he teaches are sensible, regardless of a person’s belief system” (Cali, 5:01 PM), why does he need to insert the biblical references? Is it a cynical attempt to leverage his market position with christians, or simply to sound wise through the use of culturally familiar aphorisms?

Great show Cali,

If I were Cali I too would have informed beforehand that Dave’s a Christian. I think it’s awkward when I discover that someone is religious in the middle of a conversation. Had Cali not said anything it would be awkward to all of a sudden have God be a topic in an interview.

For those who might be “nervous” about the fact that Dave Ramsey is a Christian and his philosophies have a Christian bend to them - I’m a Wiccan, and I’ve been semi-following his advice for about 3 or 4 years now. I don’t find him pushy, in-your-face, or exclusive at all. There’s the occasional mention and it’s used illustratively, but I’ve never been offended or felt excluded by anything I’ve heard him say.

With his books, I just skimmed over the more Christian-oriented sections and still got a lot of value out of the rest.

I did a double take when i saw the name Dave Ramsey in the geekbrief title in iTunes! i thought something crossed up in iTunes since both podcasts are in my playlist as shows i watch or listen to religiously - no offense to the non-religious. But instead, it was like my 2 favorite shows got married - in an rss with enclosures kind of way.

@Michael:
“Could you imagine the US or UK banning someone from the airwaves because he happened to be a Buddhist?”

“Banned” is the wrong word. But he/she simply would not have a job in factual television if their personal views were mentioned. He could be a Buddhist, Cowboys fan, Communist or even a Republican, but as soon as you share those views with the audience, the line is crossed.

Now he’d be OK as a guest, being interviewed about his point of view over here, but he would simply never be a host/presenter.

If you watch BBC news sometime, you’ll notice that there isn’t any editorial opinion from newsreaders/hosts - ever - all opinion comes from guests, and they’re required to give equal air time to both sides of an argument.

Oh - and I know this is majorly off topic now, but I do find it fascinating - and think we’ve managed to have a reasonable discussion about religion without resorting to flame throwing, which is pretty cool.

Awesome podcast, ‘Cali’.
Had such a fun time at the meetup.
Hope you & Neal can find your way down here again.

http://www.twitter.com/thoughtquotient

My wife and I love Dave and his advice has totally change our family tree forever.

We just became debt free last week and it feels awesome! We may try to call the show this Friday!

This is actually the first Geek Brief I’ve ever watched. Great show Cali!

I just want to second Dom’s observation that the tone of this excellent discussion is pretty cool. Cali and Neal are good, well-mannered people and it’s so refreshing that they attract that kind of audience as well. I wish more of the web praticed this level of civility. Well done, everyone!

Dom and Gedrod, Dave’s language is peppered with Christianity because A) he’s a Christian and B) the things he talks about he learned from the Bible. Believe me, that doesn’t mean the principles he teaches don’t have merit or should be discounted in some way. Isn’t that like saying we should re-think basic math if a Christian believes that 2+2=4? I thought we Christians were supposed to be the close-minded ones! ;) And the cool thing about Dave is he doesn’t say you have to believe the way he does to benefit from the principles he teaches everyday. Seriously, if you guys want to check out one of Dave’s books, just let me know and I’ll have one sent to you. Great conversation going on here, and great work Cali and Neal!

Here here. Quite a productive discussion. Interestingly I think that Cali and Dave probably do more to attract people to Christianity than some of the “best” evangelists clouding the air-waves. I had a former pastor who often said that “you don’t need to sell Christianity if you live it. People will want what they see in you. If they don’t, you might want to ask yourself what they are seeing in you.”

I’m not sure I would agree that Christian dogma is all that common in the mainstream media. It’s values are more often mocked or given token gestures these days, especially on film and TV. I don’t have a lot of experience with foreign media though so it may seem different to someone comparing the media in Australia or Britain to ours. Luckily this global audience can help provide me with some perspective!

Chris Thomas,

You have twisted my words, or chosen to misunderstand them. I did not say that he was not competent or helpful on the topics of debt avoidance or debt reduction.

To paraphrase what I said… I cannot see, from my cultural point of view how anyone could find it constructive to blend dogma and aphorism, founded on an unevidencable belief in the supernatural and embroidered by organisations with dubious motives over hundreds of years, with financial advice.

Gedrod, I should have done a better job of distinguishing which portion of my comment was meant for each of you. My apologies. Only the A) and B) portion was intended for you, in response to you saying his peppering of Christian references in this interview and in the rest of his material were “bizarre.” You then asked why he did it and wondered if it was “a cynical attempt to leverage his market position with christians, or simply to sound wise through the use of culturally familiar aphorisms?” I was simply letting you know that the answer to that question is “neither.” He does it because he’s a Christian (therefore it influences his view on almost everything) and because the Bible is the source of the principles he’s discussing everyday. That’s all.

Wow, It really does shock me the people immediately dismiss Dave when it comes out he is Christian.

So, lets talk about Murder. Do we all agree that Murder is wrong? Now, what if I tell you I’m a Christian, and that the Bible’s 6th (of the 10) commandments is “Thou shalt not murder”. Do you suddenly dismiss my “wisdom” that murder is wrong? Further, is murder now acceptable because my reference came from the Bible? Of course not, murder is wrong regardless of the source of the law.

Really that seems to be what is being said here. You aren’t going to take Dave’s advice, because its based on faith. The advice Dave gives is sound; Live within your means, stop spending more than you make, save up for a rainy day, save up for retirement and your children’s post-secondary education. What’s religious about that?

Really, what he’s doing is the most humble, and non-threating method of evangelism. He’s giving good, sound, secular advice, and then saying “Oh, and the reason I’m giving everybody all this good advice is because I’m a Christian, and I’ve learned from my religion that I should help other people. If you want to know more about that…” … And if you don’t want to know more, *DON’T*, just take the advice, and stop being stupid with your money. He’s not saying that you have to convert in order to take his advice!

Are we comparing Dave Ramsey with Mel Gibson now? Because I can take Dave pretty seriously as a Christian. Mel Gibson…not so much.

Seriously though, I can see how the “Christian” label can turn people off. There are tons of Christian evangelist that I cannot take seriously. Especially ones who are on TV and radio. I do believe Dave is an exception.

I am curios about the UK though and I am being completely sincere by asking this… If you want to have a media presence there, do you have to be atheist or agnostic? Or do you just have to keep your beliefs under your hat to succeed? What is the religion of choice across the pond?

Where was the first part (Cali in a parking lot near an intersection) filmed, somewhere in Nashville? Just curious.

@Jon: That was in Memphis, while we were driving back from Nashville. I think it was the parking lot of the Memphis Welcome Center.

Lost me as a viewer.

Hi Cali,

Love your brief… you got yourself a new viewer.

Your great! Don’t let anybody change the way you act. Please!

So…we break even? ;) Glad to have you with us, onerocker!

@ ben4rest, really, you made one of the best posts in response to Dom. The U.S., ideally, is about freedom of speech and opinion. Dom has given us the sense that the U.K. isn’t all that supportive of free speech. Is that accurate?

As a libertarian, freedom is key. I’m a Christian but I want to support the rights of athiests to voice their opinions whenever and however they can. I want to enjoy that same right for myself.

The large size file isn’t loading. I’m guessing it’s a problem with this file and not my settings coz I just played the large one of brief 242 with no problems.

@Lee: The extra large file is huge. The show is almost ten minutes, so it’s twice as long, and will take twice as long to load properly before playing. If you’re playing in a browser, just leave it until it starts to play. If you get a Question Mark in front of the Quicktime Logo, then there’s something wrong. Let me know!

Never be afraid to stick by your beliefs and if others are offended, who cares. Christ offended quite a few folks with his words when He was on earth. I seriously doubt that he cared if He offended anyone when He spoke since everything out of His mouth was the Truth.

If someone stopped watching your show over the iphone/God made comment. Let them go, I’m sure they are easily offended by just about everything in life.

Hey Cali
Your doing a great job. its been a while since i was able to watch but i can’t wait to see the new breif.
Don’t worrie about people who are so narow minded that they get ofended or can’t respect other peoples veiws.
Talk to you soon. oh yea I’m still alive:-) see you in a few months

Very cool Cali. I wish I had know you and Neal were in Nashville. I could have bought you guys lunch.

BTW, this is actually Dave’s second interview on a vlog. We interviewed him for my old vlog realVerse, check it out here >> http://hotair.com/archives/2006/08/24/cut-the-cards/

Cali,

You said, “I hate that, because I don’t ever want to offend anyone…”

Stop trying to ‘not offend’ anyone. Be youself, be polite but speak the truth. Anything else comes accross as disingenuous.

Cali:

Great show and terrific conversation. I know I am quite late to the party, but I lead a busy life and generally watch about a week’s worth of briefs in a single sitting.

I had never heard of Dave Ramsey before this episode of the brief; I have just added one more podcast that I need to try to fit in now and again. Like you and Neal, my wife and I managed to get out of debt before discovering Dave, but it is still worthwhile to listen to his advice and join his community. Getting the debt off of your back is such a huge blessing of freedom.

Yep, I used that code word, folks. Like a lot of engineering oriented geeks, I have no trouble with the idea that the world has a created order.. I also have no trouble at all with a guy like Dave who lives with logic and enthusiasm and does not mine sharing the source of his inspiration.

Keep up the great work Cali.

I just read through the comments and my comment is, let’s keep the main thing the main thing: Dave Ramsey gives great financial advice.

We have been following him for 3 years and began by making a budget and living off less than we make. Result is we have paid off over $55,000 in consumer debt and have changed our buying habits for life!

We are glad that we have freedom of speech in this country; otherwise we wouldn’t have heard his program on the radio and listened to his comments about “living like no one else so that later we can live like no one else”. Meaning, be willing to work like the dickens now so that later we can reap the results of solid finances.

Dave Ramsey rocks!

I don’t want to hear about religion from Dave Ramsey. Fine, go and be debt free. Don’t give this guy your money. Don’t buy his books. I am tired of hearing about how he was broke. Couldn’t have been broke for too long. Now he is rich by getting money from good Christians. Nice.